Episode Summary
Nick and Thom were married in a big, open field in Oakland California. This was right after same-sex marriage was legalized in the US and it was a huge celebration. Join us for a glimpse of their special day.
Episode Resources
→ Queer Spirit Podcast: https://queerhealingjourneys.com/podcast/
Episodes by Topic
→ Episodes on Rites of Passage: https://ever-changing.net/rites-of-passage
→ Episodes on Authentic Weddings: https://ever-changing.net/authentic-weddings
→ Episodes on Grief & Loss: https://ever-changing.net/grief-loss
→ Episodes on Challenging Times: https://ever-changing.net/challenging-times
Support the Show
→ Subscribe In Your Favorite Player: https://kite.link/shamepinata
→ Rate & Review: https://ever-changing.net/rate-sp
About the Show
Shame Piñata is hosted by Ritual Artist Colleen Thomas, a Certified Meditation and Mindfulness teacher who helps people make sense of life through ceremony. Music by Terry Hughes.
Listen If
→ You’re feeling stuck
→ You’re going through a tough time
→ Something significant has happened and no one gets it
Full Transcript
Thom: And it was funny when we were in - was it Nevada City?
Venegoni: Nevada City.
Thom: I was... went to this cafe and there's this woman we know from another witchcraft tradition and I hadn't seen her for years and I'm sitting there writing this ritual that we have been in ritual space creating and then she walks in. And she's like, "What are you doing," and it was actually somebody who I could tell her what I was actually doing, not just like, "Oh, I'm writing my wedding ceremony." And, but she really supported my flow at that moment. It was great. So random...
It’s the little moments in our lives that can be so rich. Little moments when synchronicity pops and we are seen at a deep level. These moments can and will happen at random, and they can also be thoughtfully cultivated with patience and care through ceremony or ritual design. And it’s truly wonderful to go through that design process as part of a team.
This is Shame Piñata. I’m Colleen Thomas. Welcome to Shame Piñata, where we talk about creating rites of passage for real-life transitions.
Thank you so much for joining us today. If you’ve listened to any of our episodes from season one, you know that we mostly focused stories about weddings. This season we will branch out to share stories of people using ritual to honor a myriad of life transitions. But we will still keep talking about weddings from time to time - including today! Today we will hear the story of the handfasting of my guest Nick Venegoni and his husband Thom. It happened in a big open field in Oakland California and we’d like to take you along and give you a glimpse into the day. Handfasting is an ancient Celtic ceremony in which the folks getting married or committing to each other have their hands tied together as a symbol of their connection. It is commonly associated with the Wiccan or Pagan traditions, however it is working its way into ceremonies in other traditions and even secular ceremonies. Here’s Thom.
Thom: You can create any ceremony you want to make that handfasting happen. You know, there's a sort of a template for marriages in our society that everybody is very mapped to and a handfasting gave us the opportunity to step outside of that pre-scripted experience to make something that was more meaningful and important and reflective of who we are.
Thomas: So what was the setting for your handfasting?
Venegoni: Well, we actually spent a lot of time trying to find a place that we wanted to hold it at because we wanted to have it in a space where we could be... have the ceremony outside and then depending on, you know, the weather possibly go inside if we needed to. But we had it in early May and so we were fairly lucky with weather and we ultimately landed at a park up in Oakland Hills called Joaquin Miller Park, which is a large park and there's lots of areas to it and this is a particular area. It's sort of you go up the hill and as you're driving in, you can actually look west and see all of the Bay Area and San Francisco from there. But then once you go in, it feels very secluded and like you're in the middle of nowhere in the woods in this big sort of field where we had it. So that's where it was.
Thom: Yeah, we basically rented a giant field in the park from the city of Oakland for the day.
Thomas: And they were 200 people at your ceremony?
Venegoni: At least, yeah.
Thomas: Yeah. I'm curious what the process was... that planning process, which is such a rich time for couples. Was it like a spark of idea for one of you and the other one was like, "Oh, yeah!" or would like... and what was the process you went through between, like the beginning and like getting to that day?
Thom: The beginning, middle and end that led us to the beginning?
Thomas: Right!
Thom: Act One, no... Well first, we used ceremony to create the ceremony. So there was actually more to it. We had created sacred space in a way that we do, and we invoked the Muse, you know, just the spirit of inspiration. And then we went into our own experience and just tapped into spirit and let that information flow through as like, what are you being drawn to? What feels important? What's gonna... you know... and we weren't judging or questioning anything that came up just like any good brainstorming session. But this was like spiritual brainstorming. So it was really about what is moving our energy and making us feel connected to the magic of this ceremony. So we... and then we wrote all that down and we use that as our blueprint to start to craft the ritual and incorporate those elements. Like, how do we get there? We now know where we kind of want to go, but then how do we get there?
Venegoni: And then, a few weeks later, I think we ended up going to... we went out of town to go visit a friend of mine and in this little town up in the foothills. And I was hanging out with my friend, and Thom just took all those notes and went and sat in a cafe one day and sort of came up with the first draft I think...
Thom: Well, not sort of. I did. Then I put all of those... that vision together into the beginning of a cohesive whole. You know, things were coming through, like we wanted song and community and we wanted people... everyone to be able to participate. And we didn't want like a... one person who stood in front of us and we really wanted, like a collaborative ceremony. And then we just like... ideas for, you know, like colors and props and ways to communicate with people and...
Venegoni: And even elements like water, like we both got an impression of water. We're like, well, we don't know how we're going to bring water into it. We're not going to be near a body of water but we'll figure that out. And then I think there was something else about dancing, we wanted to have dancing be part of it.
Thom: Mmm hmmm.
Venegoni: And then we asked a friend of ours who we've known for a number of years to, not necessarily be the officiant, but we were calling her the priestess of ceremonies, to sort of be the ringleader. And so then we met with her I think, at least one or two times and got her feedback about what might need to be changed or adjusted from her perspective in terms of being the one who's going to be running the show most of the time.
Thom: Yeah, the whole “how is this actually gonna work/boots on the ground?” So, yeah, there were a lot of phases to it, it was like a two hours ceremony that was just kind of non-stop.
What came through very clearly for Nick and Thom was that they wanted to have a ceremony that was about not only them but also about their community. They wanted to create a magical, transformative experience for everybody to be in a Love Spell together and for each person to weave their own love magic, for themselves, for Nick and Thom, and for the world.
Thom: It had a lot of layers, but we needed the, you know, sort of to “cast”, you know, put the right people in place, who would be able to, you know, hold it properly, witness it properly. Because we had a lot of, you know, in the lingo "unrehearsed participants". So there are people who we knew were familiar with various forms of this form of ritual... this type of ritual... like in general. And then we had, you know, people from like our family or friends of friends who this might have been the first time they've done something like this. So we couldn't let it be totally technical. But we had to move this... move the ceremony in a way to let people naturally invoke and fall into and create the energy as the spell was continually shaped until we kind of sort of sent it off as a prayer to the universe at the culmination of the spiral dance.
Nick and Thom put most of their wedding gifts toward bringing in an art photographer they knew and loved to fully document the day in his own artistic style. As we talked, Nick and Thom looked through their wedding album and reflected on the day.
Thomas: Can you describe one or two of those pictures for us?
Thom: Sure. Well, on the cover is the actual... our hands fasted. You know, a lot of people even like gay men, we see a lot of like gay men's weddings and they look just like sort of straight people's weddings, but the gay version and two guys wearing tuxedos or whatever. But even like our clothes, we had somebody, like hand-make us these sort of like loose linen clothes so that we could be comfortable and I wore all yellow and Nick wore all red. So kind of like the Queen of England, you would know exactly where we were, right? Like we... Because it was a big crowd and a big space and so that was one way we drew attention to ourselves. So it's our hands and over the bowl of water. So water came into it because we had this blessing. We had a big bowl of water and we didn't want one officiant... we had to explain what we had our mistress of ceremony... priestess of ceremonies explained that at some point in the ritual everybody was going to become our officiant. So we had this bowl of water and then like everybody lined up and we didn't want to sit there and have to talk to everybody like, "Oh, this is so beautiful, thank you," you know, blah, blah, blah... We didn't have time or space or energy for that. So we had somebody else come up with a simple song and we were like, "Everybody just sing this simple chant song while you're in line and when you while you come up to us..." Because it was also just part of the energy... And then they put their hands in the bowl and then they sort of said their silent blessing for us and then like poured... like sprinkled that water on our hands. So our hands were over the bowl of water and that was what was on the cover of the book is us with our hands fasted over the bowl of water during the part where everybody was coming up to us singing this lovely song about, "All life comes from the sea. Everything returns to the sea." And anyway, so that's the front cover of the book. You just see, like our hand... the hands fasted over the blessing bowl, which was actually the moment when in sort of a traditional ceremony they're like, "I now pronounce you," but like everybody was doing it. But we didn't want them to... they're not making our relationship, we're making our relationship, but we want their blessing. And also, it was very important for us and for the spell for the Love Spell and for the magic to have our community, like acknowledge, like two men making this, you know, commitment, this romantic commitment. Because we're creating like this energetic template of something that, you know, exists in the world in... like ambivalent, and sometimes controversial, and lots of times, invisible way. And we were, like, part of the magic was putting it right out there - not like once but you know, 200 times.
Vengoni: And that part of the ceremony was actually for me one of the most magical things because this thing happened. And at one point, I'm like, why is this happening? So, Thom's cord was red, my card was green, and then they were sort of tied together over our hands. And about halfway through, I looked down and the water in the bowl is turning blue. And I'm like, "What is going on here? This is like... we are transforming water with the magic!" And it wasn't until about we almost got all the way through that my mind, because I was so in the moment, started thinking more analytically, "Oh, it's probably dye from the green cord was leaking from the water into the bowl, turning it blue."
Thom: I could see that people really wanted that, that moment with us, and that we weren't going to be able to have that and so we had to like engineer that. We weren't going to have, like a reception line, you know that that whole thing. So um... So that was amazing to basically be married by every single person we invited.
We’re so glad you are here! If you enjoy the show, you can become part of the Shame Piñata community by sharing your story about how you marked an important life transition, either the kind they do or don't make party decorations for. Visit the contact page at shamepinata.com to get in touch. And if you have a friend who is in wedding planning mode, please share this episode with them.
I shared that a big focus of the Shame Piñata podcast is to encourage people do whatever they might want to do for their wedding instead of what might be expected of them and our conversation turned to the wedding industry and the pressure it can create for couples.
Thom: Well, that's commercialism and capitalism and you know... they want you to believe that the only way you're gonna get that meaningful experience is if your budget is at a certain level and you consume these things. And then your ceremony just becomes about whether... how good you feel about how close you came to that ideal, rather than that you just were witnessed by the people who love you making a commitment to somebody that you want to spend your life with.
Venegoni: Well, I also think that's the the blessing of being queer, you know, not just around your wedding, but around anything is that, you know, there's a challenge that comes with it, because you have to create something new because it hasn't really existed before. Although we're getting far enough along now where things have existed before for younger queer people. But, you know, so the challenge is you have to create it. But the gift is that you get to create whatever you want. You don't have to do some predetermined thing. I mean, some people feel like they have to try to fit into this box that other straight people, things that other straight people have done before, but you have the chance to create something new that's going to be right for you, whether that's your wedding, or your relationship, or your job, or the way that you run your household, or who your family are, you know, any of those things...
Thom: Yeah, and the rest of it is just pictures of, you know, various moments like drumming and spiral dance and...
Thomas: Were the two of you in the center of the spiral dance, or were you n the spiral?
Venegoni: Yeah, we ended up in the center. Yeah.
Thom: And our friend Urania, who's a Reclaiming Tradition teacher and priestess, she's really good at leading spiral dances. So we had her... because there was no way we were going to be able to think at that point. We needed somebody who just knew... had done it so much, it was just in her body, you know. And so she was in the front and then it was Nick and then it was me. And so we wound in, we just ended up in the middle. So instead of like winding in, and then normally wind back out again. We just wound in and then stayed there. So then we were like in the center. So then when everybody was... let go of each other's hands, we were like in the center of this big onion, you know, of just love and power and getting to just take it all in. There was actually a funny part during the ritual. This is actually one of my favorite things. Right after we had our hands fasted, the priestess of ceremonies, Jenya, she had found like four plants in the group that she went to beforehand and was like, "Okay, there's a part of the ritual when this happens, I'm going to you and you need to do this." So they were going to call to us, and we had to then... but they were calling to us from like four different parts of the circle at one time. So obviously, if we're tied together, we can't just tear off willy-nilly. We have to figure out: What are we doing? What's our priority? Who... what direction are we going to go together? And it was like a challenge for us, like a spiritual challenge in the midst of the ceremony that was like an energetic template for what it's like to be married, you know, where it's like, "Oh, if we're going to... we're tied together, we have to kind of figure out like, when do we go in your direction? And when do we go my direction when there's not agreement" you know? So it was this funny moment. We were both like, like... a cartoonish moment where we just sort of took off, like, like... "I'm going this way," "I'm going that way," like, "Oh, wait, we're like, tied together. What are you going to do, tear my arm off?" You know, like, like a rubber band kind of thing where we sort of like popped away from each other and then sort of snapped back and kind of bonked heads. And you know... And then we had to sit and have a conversation in front of everybody... a quiet... they couldn't really hear what we were saying. We're like, "What do we... what do we do? Which way do we go?"
Venegoni: "Where do you wanna go? Where do I wanna go?"
Thom: ...you want to go? Yeah, I want to go... And so then we just made a decision and walked towards somebody. And everybody was like, "Yay, they figured out their first challenge as a married couple!" Because we've been together for like, 12 years already, you know?
Venegoni: No, it was... [COUNTS] nine years.
Thom: Nine years. So that was like, another way that the... our community was witnessing us behaving as a married couple and we were like normalizing. Like, yes. See, we're married. And this is what married people do. We're just, it's just like every other marriage where you have to figure it out. And this is not any different. And we just got, like, 200 people in one moment to go, "That's a marriage!" So it was just great. We were just built in a lot of that affirmation felt really, really important. Because, you know, the legal, the Supreme Court decision had only come down that July of 2013. And we actually got legally married at a courthouse with a friend of ours in August of 2013. Because we knew we were ready and we just did it. And then we then had this other ceremony in May, that was more of, like the public. Because, you know, legally we needed to just get the paper signed. You know, we already... everything else was in place, but then we had to have like, the big celebration.
Venegoni: Yeah, we actually used our photo that we took of us the day we got legally married as our wedding announcement.
Thom: Yeah. But we didn't tell people, "We got married at the courthouse and now we're gonna... we're getting really married." We know it was all it was all... You know, we had been denied that we couldn't have gotten married any sooner, you know. We could do domestic partnership. We could do all these legal things. So um, so again, it was so new that we really wanted to like... There was a political element, a little bit of political theater involved, also, where we really were like, let's not just sort of like, hide and be quiet about this. Let's go, “ Okay, you know, like, no take backs. This is it. We're done. We're moving forward now.” This is the new beginning point for all of us. And of course there are still people who are resistant to that, but we're not... there's no... we're not going back.
I am so grateful to Nick and Thom for sharing their planning and ritual process for such a large-scale event, and grateful to have had a peek into their special day. I want to encourage and remind you that if you ever find yourself in wedding planning mode, know that the sky is the limit in terms of your choices for ceremony creation. Of course there are financial realities and familial traditions will be part of the story, but your imagination and ability to step outside the box will always be there for you.
Nick Venegoni & his husband Thom live in San Francisco, California and have been together for 15 years. Nick is the host of The Queer Spirit podcast and is a sound healer practitioner, who enjoys making home made pickles. Thom is a mystic and ritualist in the school of Natural and Ancestral Witchcraft and co-creator of the Trees and Stars open coven for the exploration of the Hidden Mysteries of Spirit, Nature, Self, and Cosmos.
Our music is by Terry Hughes. Be sure to subscribe on your favorite podcast player to make sure you're notified when new episodes are released. Learn more at shamepinata.com. I’m Colleen Thomas. Thanks for listening.